BTB 18 | How To Be Iconic


How does one become iconic? At 22 years old, Kenneth Pabon has become a huge personality on TikTok, YouTube, and other social media platforms for posting funny videos about his life and family, including his viral bottoming routine video and the “How to be Iconic” series. Living in upstate New York with his boyfriend, Kenneth thrives in the influencer lifestyle and has launched his OnlyFans account, where he posts content that is too risqué for social media. Meeting The Bunny Barbie for the first time, Kenneth shares his introduction into the world of TikTok and how it has changed his life for the better. He also talks about coming out in a deeply homophobic community and how being on social media helped him love his identity all the more. Listen in to this exciting conversation and find out what these two icons share in common!

Watch the episode here:

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How to Be Iconic with Kenneth Pabon

I’m excited to talk to you.

I’m fangirling a little bit. I’d like to hold you over the arms a little bit. I started TikTok and I was like, “I love you. I love Bunny. I need to do what she’s doing.”

That’s cute. Where are you from?

I’m from Long Island, in Merrick.

I can see you and your mom on The Real Housewives.

That would be our goal there.

I see it in your future.

I hope so. Fingers crossed. That would be her dream.

Why don’t you tell everyone what’s your @, what stuff you post about and then we’ll get into chatting?

I’m Kenneth Pabon, that’s my @ on everything, YouTube, Instagram and TikTok. My niche is making fun and funny videos with my family specifically with my mom. We have a new series on how to be iconic. We have a bunch of fun stuff.

Has your mom been on social media or are you pushing her to get on to it?

I pushed her. I was in college in New York City and the quarantine happened and I was like, “I got to move home. It’s a mess in the city.” I moved back in with my parents even though I was still in college at the time and I was like, “Let’s start making TikTok.” From there, it took off. It was so much fun. I didn’t stop.

Are you super close with your mom?

Yeah. We’ve got closer over the years.

Tell me more about you. What else? I’ve seen the iconic series, that’s how I found you. I was like, “I’m following him back. I’m obsessed.”

This is random but the only reason I got a following on TikTok was that I was raising Sea Monkeys at first. They’re these baby shrimp that you put in water on Amazon. I was super bored. I was like, “What am I doing?”

Do you grow them?

Yeah. It’s a kid’s toy.

I want to get one. It’s not real?

They’re real. They’re microscopic. I don’t know why I bought them. I might have been a little intoxicated.

They get bigger and you can see them better?


What do they eat?

Little rock like food. It’s gross. I don’t know why I did it. It was a spur of the moment decision. I made a video. It was my second TikToks and it blew up and I was like, “I’m the Sea Monkey King now.”

Are they still around?

No, they’re not. I gave them to my cousin. At that point, I was like, “What am I doing with these things?”

How long do they live?

Two months.

They pass away? Do they have a long lifespan?

I honestly don’t know. I gave them to my cousin. It’s like, “These are all yours. Take them. They’re for you.” I don’t know what they are. They’re bacteria in a little cup of water. It’s interesting.

Did you do that daily?

Yeah. I was like, “Day one of raising Sea Monkeys. Day two of raising Sea Monkeys.” I would make funny videos about it. I was naming each one of them. That was my first viral video.

Why did you decide to start posting how to be iconic with your mom?

My niche has changed so much over time.

I yell about everything.

Your brand is you talk. It’s your voice.

While we’re on this podcast, I’m probably going to hit a million followers.

That’s a monument. I’m happy to be here for you. I’m surprised you don’t have more.

I irritate people.

You’re a die-hard Bunny fan or you’re not at all.

People hate me specifically straight men and older women.

A bit of jealousy.

Some older women are nice to me and they send me messages sometimes but it’s rare, I’d say maybe ten per time. Anyone over 40 hates me so much.

My mom is obsessed with you.

I love her.

She talks about you all the time. She’s like, “Bunny posted this. You should do that.” I’m like, “Fine, mom.”

Are you living with her?

Yeah. I’m in an Airbnb with my boyfriend, Upstate New York.


In Eldrin.

I’m from Albany. It looks cute. It looks woodsy.

It’s a log cabin. We were like, “We’re trying to have a little moment and get away for a little bit.”

It looks modern.

It’s a cute, chic little log cabin moment.

I love it with the black doors. It’s great.

It’s random of me but I was like, “Why not?”

Have you and your boyfriend been together this whole COVID time or is this new?

We’ve been together for a while. We’ve been on and off for three years. He doesn’t do social media. He wasn’t into it. I introduced him to my platforms. That’s why everyone thinks we started dating but I’m like, “He’s been here for a minute.”

I didn’t post my husband on my social media for two years after we were together. We were together for a long time before I ever posted any pictures with him. I wanted to commit before I was like, “This is who I’m with now.” I felt it was a lot.

You don’t post him on your TikTok that often.

I still don’t even post him. I didn’t post anything of him. He’d be fine but people are weird about him. The less that I keep him on, they’re more interested in him. I remember there was a week and I had five viral videos in a row and they were all saying stuff about him. He was like, “This is weird. Move on.”

I completely agree.

If you google me, the top thing that comes up is who’s my husband. People are obsessed.

It’s your platform. Why do they care? That’s also another thing. I want the platform to be about me. It’s not a relationship channel. That’s another aspect of my life that I haven’t shared. If I’m making funny videos, I don’t want to share my boyfriend.

BTB 18 | How To Be Iconic

How To Be Iconic: Your platform is about you. It’s not a relationship channel.


I agree. It’s my brand. I barely even show my son. It’s about me. It’s not about my whole family. It’s my way of getting my thoughts and feelings out.

You’re ranting.

Every day. It’s crazy because my views are high. If I leave my house and I see a girl between the ages of 11 to 25, I know she’s going to come up to me and say hi. I would know it. I cannot leave my house. Even in different states, every time I see a younger girl, I’m like, “They’re going to recognize me.”

You have a familiar face.

I don’t think so. Even if I would be wearing a mask, I’m like, “How did you recognize me?”

Before TikTok, I knew you for some reason. I was like, “Who is this? I know who she is.” I don’t know if you were in the spotlight before but I was like, “Why do I know her? Who is Bunny?”

It’s weird because I feel like I look like a normal white girl. People recognize me everywhere. It’s weird. I’m on guard because I grew up in a rougher area. I’m always on guard in general when I’m in public, looking out. I’ll look at people and then they’ll look at me and they would be like, “Huh.” I’m like, “What?” I get scared. They’re like, “I love you.” I’m like, “Okay.”

That’s your brand. Everything is like, “It’s the Bunny.”

We were in Key West, we went for a day. I haven’t been in of my house in so long. We had to fly the airplane and we went there for the afternoon and then came home. We were walking around and at first, this girl recognized me at the airport, she was cute. We were walking around and I saw these two girls and I’m looking at reactions. I’m looking at her and then she starts talking to her mom and her friend and they’re in a huddle. I can see it and I was like, “Whatever.” They went into a store.

My husband was getting a coffee at a coffee shop and I’m standing outside with my son in a stroller and the girl runs out and her friend is like, “I can’t believe you’re going to ask this.” She was like, “Can I take a picture with you?” I was like, “Yeah, sure.” I’m taking a picture with them. My stepdaughter took a picture of me and the other girl. They go back inside and I’m still standing there waiting for my husband to get his coffee and fifteen people in the store are standing at the window like a little CVS or something like that. They’re standing there and staring at me, even like men too. I’m looking at them and I’m like, “Hey.” They’re waving at me back and staring at me and I’m like, “We need to get out of here. This is weird.”

That is funny.

It made me uncomfortable.

It’s like, “Hi. How are you?” One time, there was a Starbucks barista and he was like, “You’ve been on my For You page.” I was like, “Thank you.”

It’s not necessarily that I have a lot of followers. I get 4.5 million views a day. I’m on a lot of people’s For You page. They put me in a specific group, younger girls. At least it’s not men. I would hate TikTok if they sent me to a male audience.

I don’t think an older male audience could relate to you at all. They’d be like, “What’s going on?”

They hate me so much. What are your analytics? Is it mostly women?

My second viral video was my bottoming routine.

Can you explain that?

It was top and bottom. I was like, “These are the products that I use before I bottom. I use this oil, this spray. I take fiber supplements.”

Isn’t fiber bad?

It binds you up if you know what I mean. It was random. I did not expect it to blow up. Do you know the trend, pretend to be an influencer in front of your family?


I did the trend, pretend to be an influencer in front of my family and I went through my bottoming routine. It was a joke. I was like, “This is what I used before.”

They’re in the background?

They all reacted to it. They’re sitting at the dinner table and they’re all staring at me, like, “What is he doing? Is he telling us all this information now? What he does before he bottoms?” It was their reactions and then people were like, “We want to hear what you have to say about bottoming.” I was like, “Okay.” I did a full YouTube video on it. That was my first YouTube video and it went viral on YouTube, My Bottoming Routine. It got 200,000 views. It went viral.

That’s good for YouTube.

On YouTube, I went again and I was like, “People like my family.” That’s how my TikTok spiraled into my family.

That’s cute. Is your mom married?

She is.

Are they interested in being on your channel too or they’re like, “Whatever?”

My mom loves it. My mom loves the spotlight. She’s thinking like she’s a movie star. She gets her makeup ready. She’ll do her makeup for five hours for a thirteen-second TikTok. I’m like, “She’s having fun. This is her moment and she’s loving it.” My dad is a little self-conscious. He has a full-time job career. He’s like, “Is that what I should be doing?” He’s been in a few videos but he’s like, “I don’t know if this for me.” The rest of my family loved it. My two brothers are also on TikTok. They started growing their accounts. It’s been fun. It brought us all closer because it’s something to do.

You started this during COVID, right?


Life is going to be weird after.

Lowkey, I’m enjoying being a little troll and staying inside.

I love having an excuse to not go somewhere.

Same. I could work on my phone. I could do everything online. I’m like, “This is great.”

I don’t have to get ready some days if I don’t feel like it. You get ready and you make some videos.

Do you get ready every day? You’re always sitting in your closet. It’s like, “She’s ready.”

Before TikTok, I would put on makeup every three days and feel good about myself. Now, I’ve been making a little bit more content so it’s every two days to one day not wearing makeup. I usually get ready live and I do my makeup routine as I chat with people and whatever. I will record fifteen videos and then post them within the next three days.

Do you post that much a day?

I’d say between 3 to 10 videos a day. I post a lot which is why my views are high because then it goes to your older videos and stuff too. My views are high. I make a lot of money directly off from TikTok.

Because you put so much there.

I like so much content. I’ll get ready and make videos and then I’m done. I can’t get ready every day and do that every day. It’s too much.

I can’t. Thank God for that beauty effect on TikTok my skin looks good.

You look great.

Thank you. She did a little makeup moment. It was late at night and you’re like, “Tomorrow, 1:00 PM.” I’m like, “If I’m in a log cabin in Upstate New York, I will do it. Boyfriend, go away. Go take a drive in the mountains.”

You’re like, “I need an hour.”

I’m like, “Empty the cabin. I’m doing a podcast.”

I’ve had them recorded. I haven’t been recording podcasts. If I don’t start recording them again, I’m going to forget about it. I was like, “Come to my podcast. Can you come tomorrow?”

I’m like, “Why not? What else am I doing?”

We’re also going to Wyoming. I was like, “I’m not going to have time.”

I’ve never been there but I see it’s beautiful.

It’s nice. I’m building a house there. You’ll have to come.

I saw on your live going inside.

We’re meeting with the builder and the electrician and stuff. It’s snowy and stuff over there too. We’re going to spend the weekend over there. Hopefully, our house will be done.

That would be amazing.

It’s going to be cute.

That would be a nice little Wyoming moment.

It’s cool because everyone has airplanes and different stuff in their house. Everyone is worldly and it’s cool energy to be around.

It’s your vibe, your energy.

I love that. It’s close to LA. I feel like I’m going to be in LA a lot.

You can have visitors from LA and have a good weekend trip.

It’ll be nice. Do you go to LA a lot or no?

Post whatever. Just pump it up. The more content, the better. Click To Tweet

I’ve never been to LA. I was into school. I thought I was going to be a corporate lawyer. I have an English major. I was working full time for other influencers to put myself through college because I wanted to pay for all my things. Corporate lawyer, you have to go to law school. I thought that was the only way to make money. I got an internship working for fashion influencers. I worked with them and I was like, “This is cool. You can have a platform and you can make money from it.” Right before COVID, I quit and I was like, “I’m going to do it for myself. Why am I being an assistant? I could go on my own.” A month after I quit, TikTok took off for me. I’m like, “I’m glad I made this call.”

It’s always about putting yourself out there. I have a lot of people reading that want to do their own TikTok and everything.

Post whatever is the best advice I could say.

The more content, the better.

I was always focused on working and supporting myself. My goal is to be self-sufficient and that’s why I never traveled much. It’s always been staying in the city, work and school. After that, I was like, “I got my platform.” I was a senior in college. I was like, “If I get a degree, I’m not going to use it tomorrow. If I graduated right now, what am I going to use my English degree for? I’m going to keep making content and do it full time.”

Do you plan on not graduating or you’re taking a break?

I’m going to go back. As of now, I’m going to stick to TikTok full time and on my other platforms. She’s doing it full-time, content creator.

I can see you and your mom having your TV show.

I hope so. I fully launched an OnlyFans and that was when I was like, “I’m not going to go back this semester.”

How does your boyfriend feel about that?

He loves it. He’s fully supportive. I wouldn’t have done it if he didn’t support it. I wouldn’t have done it if my parents didn’t support it. I was like, “I want to do this full time. It’s something that I can add to my brand. This is something that I respect myself.” Honestly, it made me more confident. Let’s do it. Let’s put it out there. There’s a video on my TikTok with my mom telling her about it and everyone is like, “Do it. Pictures may come out anyway at some point. You might as well do what makes you happy.”

I agree.

I don’t get as many views as you on TikTok. It’s another content service.

Do you promote it on your TikTok?

Yeah. I’m open about it because I’m not ashamed of it. People are like, “Are you going to make it in your real name?” I’m like, “Why wouldn’t I?” I’m going to make my real name. It’s my body. I’m going to give you everything, show you everything and be proud of it. I’m not going to hide my body. I’m proud.

Good for you.

Like, “OnlyFans?”

At least 50% of the people on TikTok are on OnlyFans, the creators. I’m pro-sex worker industry. People should be able to do what they want with their bodies and how they feel they want. If you want to monetize on it, you should.

Agreed. It’s given me another way to be self-sufficient as a creator.

The only danger with it is when some young girls or boys aren’t being safe and meeting up with people and stuff like that. That can be dangerous. I see a lot of TikToks where it’s older women and they’re like, “I have this glamorous lifestyle. I’m a sugar baby.” It’s a little dangerous.

That is not the message I want to send at all. OnlyFans is not what you should be aiming for. Focus on gaining a platform and see where it goes. It made sense for me because I was doing a bottoming routine and I was talking about sex and being iconic with my mom. It made sense to me to do it personally. As any content creator, I don’t think that should be your first go-to.

You have to have followers to even get a following on OnlyFans because you can’t promote it.

You can’t start an OnlyFans. No one could find it that way.

Is your following a lot of males?

On TikTok, it started with a lot of females because of the bottoming routine. A lot of girls were using it. I was like, “Go off Queen. Do what you need.” Once I launched the OnlyFans, I started getting more of a male audience. On my OnlyFans, it’s everyone. Any gender, it doesn’t matter. I have a lot of girls that subscribe to it.

I love that. I’m going to subscribe.

Bunny, I’m blushing.

That was cute.

It’s also an open platform. They ask me for advice. Girls will sign up and be like, “How do I do this? I want to do this.” I help people if they want to do that. I’m like, “I can give you advice.” I’m building people up and helping them.

You seem like such a positive person.

Yes. That was a big thing in my life. Growing up, I was super depressed in high school. I was super negative about my sexuality and everything. I got to college and I was like, “I can be positive or I can stay depressed.” I put my best foot forward since then.

In high school, did you know your sexuality?

I was dating girls. I was in denial. I was from a homophobic hometown. I would say it’s a cookie-cutter place. I was afraid to be different. Once I got to college, I was like, “I got to break free. This is it. I can say who I am or change.”

Did you come out to your family or they knew?

I came out to my brother in my senior year. A year later, I started dating my boyfriend. I was like, “You got to take me on a date right now, drive me, it’s with a boy.” She’s like, “I know. The only question I have for you is who pays?” I was like, “That’s the only question you have?” She’s like, “Honestly, I want to know if it’s going on my card.” I was like, “Thanks for being accepting but that’s the question you have here.”

That’s cute. How was your dad?

He’s good. Growing up, I thought he was not going to be accepting of it. It was an internalized homophobia that I had. When I came out, to him, he was super accepting. He was like, “If you are happy, I’m happy.” He and my boyfriend are best friends. They’re hanging out without me. I’m happy that he’s accepting. What I struggled with most was my internalized fear of what other people would think of me.

That’s interesting. That might make a lot of people feel more comfortable telling their parents, too. Maybe they’re not going to react the way that you think they will.

It’s different for everyone. You have to realize a lot of things come from within. You’re internalizing the thing.

How were your friends or your friends knew anyway?

This is interesting. With my home friends, I was a bro at one point. I lost my best friend. He didn’t speak to me after I didn’t come out. It was a good thing because if they didn’t support that, what else didn’t they support? They were never my friends anyway.

Do you think it was because they didn’t want to be friends with someone who was gay?

It’s a mixture of things. You don’t want to be friends with someone that’s gay. Maybe you think they’re going to come on to you. Also, maybe you’re hiding some things on your own. I didn’t think about it too much because I don’t want to waste my energy on that. I was like, “I don’t care. I’ll go get new friends.”

Good for you. How did you gain your confidence? I get asked this every day.

I don’t know, to be honest.

It seems like in high school, you might have not been as confident.

I was a mess. It’s not confidence that I have. I don’t care what anyone else thinks of me and that’s what made me confident. It’s like, “That’s your opinion. You’re going to think of me anyway. I don’t care what you think.” How did you get your confidence, Bunny?

I don’t know. It’s something that came as I got older, too. Honestly, it started coming when I started partying a lot. I was young. I was thirteen, fourteen. Guys would drive me around and guys would take me out.

You’re like, “I’m a badass.”

It evolved from there. I had more confidence in myself. Before, I don’t think it was so much self-love because I didn’t care about myself. I was partying a lot and I disrespected my body. Now, I’m the opposite. I respect myself so much. It comes with age and trying to find out who you are, things that you love to do, people you love to be around and stuff like that.

Honestly, I relate to the party thing. In high school, I was going out every night to the city and being reckless. It was a confidence-building thing at the time.

It’s not a good thing. It did help my confidence because I was like, “I’m going to go and do this.” Everyone would say yes to me.

All of these mattered validations. It was good.

No one ever told me no. I was like, “Okay.”

I see that all the time. I don’t like when people tell me no. It’s like, “Why no?”

Are you planning on using Tiktok the most or you’re in between Instagram and YouTube? I hate Instagram.

I don’t get it. It doesn’t do it for me.

I hate it so much.

It’s stagnant. I feel like, “Why am I looking at curated pictures and versions of everyone? Show me you in your closet ranting about something.”

What’s funny is before I had TikTok, I never once talked on Instagram. I would only post pictures of myself. I never posted on my story. I never did anything. Now, I feel like I’ve become this new person on TikTok. I have this million video that I’m posting once I hit a million followers, hopefully after this Zoom call. Before, I wouldn’t have posted a picture on Instagram without face tuning it and full glam on. Now, I’m running in my heels every day in my pajamas with no makeup on. It has changed my life. I don’t know if confidence is the thing. I feel way more comfortable in my own skin.

I wake up and I look forward to making videos. I feel so much better. I want to wake up. I want to make a funny video. I want to talk to everyone, share with them what I’m doing. It genuinely makes my day.

Me, too. I love connecting with people. It’s fun for me. A lot of people are like, “I’ve never seen a creator go on live and nice to they’re like fans and stuff.” I’m like, “I genuinely enjoy it.” I enjoy communicating with people and being a part of their life.

BTB 18 | How To Be Iconic

How To Be Iconic: Focus on gaining a platform and just see where your brand takes you.


I agree 1,000%. Instagram is stagnant. I’m past it. I don’t even promote it that much because it’s like, “I wouldn’t follow me.”

All I post is my TikToks on my Instagram because I have different people on there. It’ll be people that don’t have TikTok. People have been finding me a lot from Reels though. Have you been posting on Reels?

I did it a few times but I always get hate for my videos. On Instagram, I get more hate. When I post them to my Reels, I’m on a weird Reel niche and I get a lot of hate and DMs. It’s like, “Maybe delete that Reel.”

From men?

It’s a lot of men. They’re like, “You have a lot of sins. You are disgusting.” I’m like, “What? I’m telling you how to be iconic.” He’s like, “What makes you iconic?” I’m like, “There are many things you could pick me apart for. What do you mean sins? What did I do?” They’re projecting their insecurities on it.

People that are homophobic are like, “What do you have going on?”

Homophobia has some deep-rooted curiosity of your own sex.

You’re trying to avoid. Some of the younger girls that follow me might be Republican because of their parents and stuff. What I can say is try to come to what you think is right in the world. If you grow up in that mentality, it’s okay to not think the same things as your parents. You’d be supportive of the LGBTQ community even if you’re not a part of it because it is important to support other people and love other people regardless of what they have going on.

I completely agree. Your parents’ opinions aren’t yours. When you grow up and you have access to all the information and technology we have, you don’t have an excuse to be homophobic. You can do the research. You can go online. You can see anything. You can research gender. You can research sexuality. You can see these things for yourself. If you do have parents that aren’t as accepting, that’s okay. That’s not you. You can break the chain and be a whole new person from your family which I’m a big believer in.

It’s important to do that especially if you’re not even a part of the community, showing support for other people that are different than you, Black Lives Matter and stuff like that. You need to be a part of the future and not the past of this country.

I agree. It’s spot on.

It doesn’t matter what political party you’re with. You need to support other people. You’re supporting love and other people being nice people. Whatever category you want to say that falls under, that’s the category everyone should strive towards being.

I’m loving YouTube. It’s a little confusing. I don’t understand it.

I don’t understand YouTube at all.

I don’t get it. I don’t know where my videos go. I don’t know who views them. It doesn’t make sense in my head. I upload something and I’m like, “Now what? What happens? Where is it going?”

I have a podcast company that takes that and does all of it. I don’t know what’s going on. It happens.

As you should. That is the goal there.

I record this and then I send it to them and that’s it.

You’re like, “I don’t know. Fix it.” YouTube videos are hard to edit.

I know. How long are your videos?

It’s not even nine minutes.

It takes you an hour to edit?

Yeah. I also have no attention span to do it.

I don’t either.

I’m used to TikTok, six seconds.

I have to listen to my podcast after I record it and I put it up. One, I sit there and I listen to it. I’ll be on live and every five minutes I’ll hit pause. They’re like, “You sound like you’re bored.” I’m like, “I’m listening for sound quality things because they edit them out or words I shouldn’t have said.” I’m like, “It’s stressful for me to sit there and listen to myself for an hour after I had the conversation for an hour.” It’s like, “Oh my God.”

It’s work to hear yourself. It’s like, “What is this?”

It’s a lot.

I did a series on my YouTube, it was called Cox and Cocktails where I spoke about sex and things with my brother. I’m like, “Bobby made a cocktail.” Listening to that over and over was like, “I can’t. What are we even talking about?”

It’s horrible but then people enjoy it. I’m doing it because people enjoy the podcast but I’m like, “It’s so much work.” I then have to make sure the YouTube video matches up with this podcast, which is also already an hour long. I had my assistant and I’m like, “I cannot watch. I cannot do this for two hours.” She’s reviewing the YouTube videos.

Thank God for your assistant. I need to get myself one.

It’s a lot of editing. Does your boyfriend do any editing?

He does not. He’s a real estate agent.

He got into it. He was doing real estate in the city and then he left. He’s with me on Long Island. We have different careers. I’m fully a content creator and he’s at real estate. It’s total opposites but love it.

Did you grow up in Long Island?

I grew up in Long Island. I’m 45 minutes away from New York City. I was always going back and forth in the city and I saw that lifestyle. I always knew that’s what I wanted.

Do you want to live in New York City?

Not anymore. I’m struggling. I’m like, “Where do I want to live?” I make videos with my mom so I want to be close. Every big creator moves to LA at some point. My brand with my mom isn’t there. I like having space and being outside. Settling down, I’m up in the air about it. I still have my apartment in New York City but I don’t go there ever, which is horrible.

You have an apartment and you don’t go?

I signed the lease right before COVID. I’m stuck in the lease and I’m never there.

New York City doesn’t do it for me for some reason.

It used to. It doesn’t work for me anymore. I like to be outside. I’m struggling with where to move to. That is my latest venture, where am I moving? Where am I living?

Would your boyfriend move with you?

His work is on Long Island. He wants to stay on Long Island but he doesn’t know if he wants to move out yet. I’m like, “Okay. I’ll have an independent moment. I can do it.” I’ve always lived alone after high school. I moved out right away. I’ve been looking and seeing if I want to live and get lonely and what I want to do. I’m struggling with where to live.

New York is going to struggle to pick back up post-COVID for a while. Everyone that I know that was living in New York has moved.

A lot of people are moving Upstate.

A lot of them have moved to Florida. I know a lot of Wall Street guys.

I’m in the Financial District. I’m right there.

All of them have moved to Florida.

Maybe I’m going to have a Florida moment.

I could see you in Miami south Beach.

I’ve only been to Florida once.

Have you been to Miami?

I did. I stayed in Key Biscayne with friends and we went to Miami for the day.

I could see you living in Miami.

Maybe I got to pull Miami moment. I like the hot weather.

The weather is nice. It’s the middle of winter and I’m in a sweater and pants and it’s probably 75, 80 degrees.

I’m jealous. There’s snow on the ground in Upstate New York.

You got a lot of snow over Christmas and stuff, too.

It was a lot of snow and I’m not a snow person.

Me either. I can’t do it. I’m building a house in Wyoming.

You’re like, “Snow is not for me.”

We’ll be there in the summer because it’s so hot here in the summer. That’s the plan.

Also, they have fresh air over there. I saw on TikTok that for your son, you do the homeschooling thing. Do you teach him all yourself?

Most icons can’t drive. They don’t have to. Click To Tweet

He has a nanny that teaches him as well but I’ve been lax with his homeschooling. I also own my own children’s curriculum. When he was little, I found this curriculum. I searched for what I wanted to do and teach him. It’s Montessori-based. I don’t know if you know what that is. It’s more play-based versus actual workbooks and stuff. This woman had made this curriculum and she spent seven years making this curriculum. I use that when he was one and a half to two and a half.

I reached out to her and I was like, “I would love to be your partner and market it for you.” She was a stay-at-home mom that did this. She was like, “I’m getting a divorce. I’d love for you to buy this curriculum from me. You could own the whole thing.” I bought the whole thing from her. I’ve redesigned it. I’m slowly starting to upload it. My son does stuff like that. It’s activities versus workbooks and stuff. It’s fun games and YouTube videos to watch and certain things and certain subjects. My son is obsessed with space. He teaches me everything. I didn’t even know that there were eight planets before. There are five dwarf planets, did you know that? I did not know that.

I know nothing about space.

I know everything about it now. I’m lax with his schooling. I let him learn what he wants to learn when he wants to learn it. If he ever starts to fall behind or know things that he should he know then I’ll probably start teaching him more. He’s advanced at this point. I let him do his thing.

Honestly, the way you’re doing it is the way of the future because so much has changed since our traditional school system was built.

It’s such an archaic system.

It still is. Many people fall through the cracks and aren’t getting the proper education as opposed to you letting your son probably learn ten times more of what everyone else is learning.

He wants to learn how to read because he wants to learn to fly an airplane. I’m like, “You have to be able to read the thing.” He works on reading while we’re flying the airplane because that’s what he’s interested in.

He probably knows more than me on a lot of things.

It’s crazy.

It’s awesome. Especially with COVID, my little brother is in school and everything is online for him. I’m like, “You are ahead of the game.” When COVID happen, education did not change at all.

I had bought the curriculum but I hadn’t published any of it yet. I hurried up and got a theme out and I gave it away for free to all the moms that I knew. Everything, I put on my website. I was like, “I know you guys aren’t prepared for your two-year-old, three-year-olds to be home all day. They’re probably in preschool or daycare. Do this with your kids and have fun.”

Did they all love it?

They loved it so much.

I had no idea you’re on a curriculum. You are a multifaceted business iconic woman.

I do it all.

It’s empowering. My mom was always a housewife and she still is. That’s a huge job. On top of you being a housewife, you have many other things.

I’m a horrible housewife. I’m not a good cleaner. I don’t drive a car.

I don’t drive either. I’m horrible at it. I don’t own a car.

I own a car but I don’t drive it.

It’s stressful.

I hate it. It’s such a liability, too.

It’s also overwhelming.

I’ve never met another adult that doesn’t drive.

I cannot. I totaled my parents’ car the second week after I got my license. My boyfriend said I’m a liability. He lets me drive his car sometimes to go to Starbucks but that’s about it. Otherwise, roads are not for me. It doesn’t make sense in my head.

When I was 21, I fully stopped driving. My friends would pick me up. Uber was around like. That was it. When I met my husband, we had a full-time driver. I got pregnant and then the driver wanted to live in LA full-time so he left. I had two nannies so there was always someone here. I have a car that we all drive around in. I would Uber a lot. I don’t Uber with COVID. I either ride with my husband or my nanny. I don’t need to drive.

That’s ideal, though.

I know.

It’s another thing that requires my mental capacity. It tires me.

A lot of focus. My worry is I’m backing out of the driveway and I hit a kid or something. That’s scary to me. I don’t want to drive.

That gave me flashbacks.

It’s horrible.

I failed my road test four times.

I failed my road test three times.

I cannot drive.

I remember when I passed. I don’t know if it’s the same thing with you but I was from upstate New York. You have to drive your own car.


I don’t think it’s the same everywhere. I remember I was driving my dad’s car and there was an ice storm that day. You have to book it months in advance. I kept failing with the same. I booked it again and he was like, “Stop at the stop signal.” I’m like, “What is a stop signal?” It was a stoplight but it was a signal and I kept driving. I was like, “I can’t keep doing this with you.” We were sliding on the ice. I was like, “You smell bad. This not the vibe for me.” He was like, “I’m going to pass you because I can’t deal with you anymore.”

He’s like, “I never want to see you again. Take this and never come back.”

It was the worst.

At least you passed on your third try. The third time’s a charm.

I’ll have to ask my dad because I don’t remember.

I’m a horrible driver. That’s also part of the issue.

I can fly a plane really well.

Which is impressive. I would feel like that’s probably a lot more work than driving.

It’s different. There are a lot of things to hit. It’s up and down. When you get around, it’s around. There are no roads to follow. You type in degrees.

I would love to hear what you’re thinking as you’re flying a plane.

I saw a video that everyone kept tagging me. There was this video of this girl flying and it was like, “Things that go through my head when I’m flying. I have chapped lips. Let me open the window.” It was a whole voiceover video. I was like, “I should do that.”

You should. What do you even think when you’re flying?

Most of the time it’s on autopilot. You go up, down. Once you’re up after three minutes, you turn everything on autopilot and then you enter altitude to go up and down and then you enter in directional numbers.

The computers help.

You’re not sitting there and holding it. It’s like a jet. You do a little knob and then it goes. People on the radio call your tail number and they’re like, “Go to this angle and then you go put that number in.” Once you’re up there, it’s nothing. The up and down is the only part that you’re working at the rest of it. I’ll take my shoes off, put my feet on my husband. I lay across in the cockpit.

In my head, I imagine you’re holding it and you’re driving it like a spaceship. I don’t know why, like, “Put the desk on.”

It’s only on the up and down, which out of a 4.5-hour flight is twenty minutes.

What you’re saying is I need to learn how to fly.

Yes. You’d feel accomplished.

I would. “I can’t drive a car but I can fly, Bunny taught me.”

Everyone said that if I was on The Housewives, that would be my headline.

That would be iconic. That is perfect.

I took up so much of your time. I’m going to let you go but I’m going to ask you two questions before we get off and the first one is, what was the best part of your day?

Talking to you. I’ve always looked up to Bunny. It’s cool that it’s come full circle in TikTok and I’m on her podcast. Meeting you and chatting with you.

BTB 18 | How To Be Iconic

How To Be Iconic: When you grow up having access to all the information and technology that we have, you don’t have an excuse to be homophobic.


What did you learn?

Most icons can’t drive.


Icons don’t have to drive.

We don’t drive. Thank you so much for joining me. Do you want to repeat your @ so people can find you?

It’s Kenneth Pabon.

Thank you so much for joining me. This was so much fun.

Thank you.

Have a good day.

We love you, Bun.

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